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About the temple 03 Dec 2002
If anyone does have any news, I think it is fairly safe that we would hear about it here. All I know is that nothing has been publicized in the papers here. My conclusion is that the Church has decided to wait for the membership in the Europe East area to strengthen a bit. I believe that because they have announced a Helsinki Finland temple and recently completed renovations to the Freiburg temple that they are in no hurry and will wait to build a temple until the Church has strengthened some more.
Michael Joner Send Email
 
President Hickleys visit 13 Sep 2002
Here is a report from a Humanitarian missionaries that I work with.

"Subject: President Hinckley


Good Day to you all.
I promised I would collect my thoughts about President Hinckley's visit here. We took Svetlana from Countpart which is an organization that brings humanitarian aid into the country via other NGO's. Previous to us they brought a lot of our things in and we used them a lot to get the containers in for other NGO's. Now the system is changed and we do it via the church and through ourselves so we do not send it through anyone else. That way the church gets the credit and recognition.
Svetlana was amazed that we as a church were as big as we were in all of Ukraine. She was also surprised that we could go anywhere in Ukraine while their organization is world wide and can only work a few Oblasts at a time.
The Friday before President Hinckley came I was talking to her and asked if she would like to see him. She said she was very interested so I took an invitation to her and we agreed where to meet. She was most impressed with the amount of people who came, the place where it was held, everything. The quietness of 3,500 people, the choir, all the talks. The people hugging each other and some crying and most feeling just plain happy.
We got there an hour early and were given seats saved by Alex and his children. They were great seats as were all seats there. It is the largest hall in Ukraine. It is a small conference center. Has one balcony that hangs over just like the conference center. The accustics were excellent, chandeliers were beautiful. Not at all like the older buildings we have been to for conference meetings.
Everyone was just sitting there quietly when Pres. and Sister Hinckley and Mission Pres. and wives and necessary people came in on the stage. The curtain lifted on a choir of more than 100 people all dressed in black skirts or pants and white shirts or blouses except for a few that sat in a triangle in the middle. Very effective.
All the talks by Pres. Callister, Pres. West, and Pres Christensen were great but the anticipation for Pres. Hinckley was so great. When he took the podium the energy became more elevated than it already was just because he was there. He spoke through an interpreter who tried to keep up with him in finding the scriptures he used. He said that 21 years ago he came here when there was not a member of the church in Ukraine, Moscow, St. Petersburg, Lennongrad, Latvia. Wonderful people who later embraced the gospel and made it a part of their lives. He prays for the people here. 'You will be happy, church will grow.( I don't have all the words so you can fill them in.) He said,'I don't know how much time I have left but I want to give you my (testimony). I want to talk to you briefly (1 Peter 2:9) about a matter.' He talked about being a chosen generation, pioneers, wonderful time to be alive, science, etc, 'And on top of that the gospel. Greatest age in history of the world. You & I partake of all blessings available to the world, because of Jesus Christ and the Royal Priesthood. This is the day Peter saw. Available to all who would accept the gospel.
Brothers, keep your lives in order. I am disturbed to hear 2/3 men in Russia die of alcohol related problems. 2/3 marriages end in divorce. Lord blessed us that no such thing should happen to us. He gave us the Word of Wisdom.
I believe with all my heart that you need blessings of the Lord. You pray for them. He has set forth laws by which he will bless you. Tithing is one of those laws. You cannot afford not to pay it. Lords promise---open windows of heaven..etc. Not my promise. He can bless you." Told story of some people in china. A man and wife. They had enough money to either pay tithing or buy rice. He said they should buy rice. What would they do if they had no rice. She said they had just been baptized and promised to keep the commandments and tithing was one of the commandments. So they took what little money it was and took it to Branch President and returned home. He said, 'what are we going to do?' Next day when he went to work his boss said he was a good worker and had decided to give him a raise. The money for the raise was exactly the amount of the tithing. It is difficult but I plead with you. Take the Lord at his word. Let him fulfill his promise which I testify he will do.
Let me in conclusion tell you how much I love you. This is the first time I have seen you but I'm so glad I came. Thank you for all your good (work). I promise it is never a sacrifice when you get back more than you give. You will grow in capacity and strength. Become better men and women, better meighbors, better citizens of the nation you are in. We pray for you. Grateful for promise for us. God in Heaven will smile in favor upon you. You look so wonderful to me. Wish I could put my arms around each of you and say thank you. I probably will never see you again until at Jesus feet. Walk in faith. God will bless you, with food upon your table, cloths on your back, place to live............
By this time everyone was very emotional. I did not want to write anymore. I just wanted to look at him. I just wanted to see his eyes, his face, hear his words. When he finished the choir sang and he just stood there. He sat down and there was a closing prayer by a young adult woman from our area. The choir sang as he got up to leave. Everyone started to wave white handkerchiefs. He and his wife got a little across the stage and then he turned and walked back to the middle of the stage and up front. He just stood there and looked out. Everyone just waved the handkerchief. Not a single sound could be heard. Everyone could feel his arms around them in love just as he said he wished he could do. I thought ' this is how the Nephites felt when Jesus left them.' I know there was the choir singing somewhere "God be With You' but I don't remember exactly where. I just know I want that feeling for the rest of my life.
Our friend took Dee's white handkerchief and waved it like everyone else. She felt the spirit so strong. She put the handkerchief in her purse and wants to keep it.
After it was over we went out side with everyone else. It was an absolutely perfect evening. Not a breath of a breeze. Just the right temperature. People just hung around, seeing old friends, hugging, happy. Not loud, just peaceful joy. Some strangers walking by asked what was going on that all these people seemed so happy? Eventually we had to leave. Svetlana said whe was not ready for the missionaries but would let us know. She said she had never experienced anything quite like this. She could not ever forget that sweet, simple but great man.
George, the man we have a contract with, had his whole family there. He called us this morning and said they had all three come, his wife, daughter and son. He is the only member. His wife sometimes came to church with him but did not join. He said his daughter was not interested in the other talks but when the President started to talk she could not take her eyes off him. She listened to every word. He is so excited.
Bogdons mom brought a friend and came to it. This is her first time to be exposed to the church. Valentina said her parents would not be there but she hoped her sister and children would be there. I don't know if they made it.
It is a testimony to me that Gordon B Hinckley is truly a prophet of God. His spirit touched every person in the hall.
Even a doubter could not deny that. Sergey and his friend Sergey were there also. Sergey will be baptized when Lloyd comes over to do it. Probably next month.
I have seen other Presidents of the church. This is in fact my fourth or fifth time. But I have never been affected like I was Monday, September 9, 2002. A testimony grows by itself with every thing you think and do. When it is full it must be like Pres. Hinckley's. I want that. I want you, my friends and family to have that also. Cultivate it, read the scriptures, pray for it, hope for it. It will come.


We love you so much. Love, Elder & Sister Swensen

P.S. This is not word for word what Pres. Hinckley said, but from my sketchy notes. He said much about the royal priesthood, introduced his wife, talked about more than I have here but I hope you can catch an essence of what Ukraine felt with him here."
Jim Karper Send Email
 
Areas open in UKM 11 Dec 2001
Member count in the mission after the boundary change: about 3850. Baptism count is about 200 or 250 per year.

Kyiv - OPEN, about 1/3 Russian speaking. 2 districts, 12 branches.

Bila Tserkva - OPEN, one or two companionships.
Bogatoye - Donetsk (Crimea, 80km from Simferopol)
Brovary - OPEN, two companionships.
Cherkasy - OPEN, two companionships.
Chernivtsi - OPEN, three companionships.
Chernihiv - OPEN, two companionships.
* Illiochivs'k - OPEN, two companionships.
Ivano-Frankivs'k - OPEN, one or two companionships
Kherson (?) - Donetsk, even though Mikolayiv is so close.
Luts'k - OPEN, two companionships.
L'viv - OPEN, five companionships.
Mikolayiv - OPEN, three companionships.

Odesa - OPEN, six (?) companionships. 1 district, 3 branches.

Rivne - OPEN, two companionships, last I knew some minor problems keeping missionaries there.

Ternopil' - CLOSED. Was only open 10 months with 1 baptism.

Uzhorod - CLOSED early 2000, I think. Several members "stranded", nearest branch is L'viv.

Vinnitsya - OPEN, two companionships.
Michael Joner Send Email
 
A reply to "Ukraine Kiev Temple" - original messag 11 Dec 2001
Here goes the rumor mill again. Unfortunately we aren't likely to get concrete information.

My conclusion is that there is an 80% chance of there being land for the temple on which we can build, but only a 30% probability that construction will begin in 2002. My personal opinion is that the temple dedication will likely be within five years given that the current situation continues to improve (which I believe it has been). If it worsens, the timeline will, too.

DISCLAIMER: The remainder of this message include what I have been told. I am not an insider. I have no concrete facts. I am willing to trust that those who are visiting this site are not going to take these remarks out of context or read more into them than is really there. You'll find that most of this is opinion mingled with supposed facts.

I asked about the temple a few times while serving in the mission office. The answer is (per President Trythall) that the only source of definitive information about the temple is ultimately the Temple Department of the Church or from President Hinckley.

The permission to build problem is not as big as it has been. That does not mean that we will build anytime soon. For that matter, to my understanding it is POSSIBLE that we could build a temple now (with the minor concern that the government is still known to repossess or threaten to repossess completed building projects if even the slightest of building-related laws are violated). But I also sense that the Church is beginning a policy of not building temples in areas where tithe payment is low. I don't know specific numbers but I would hypothesize that given Ukraine's weak economy that payment of tithes is a problem.

It has been implied that construction of a temple is not likely to begin until after the creation of a stake in Kiev. The Church is very conservative about establishing a stake. Officially we are only unable to create a stake because we don't have facilities large enough to hold ward-sized congregations.

Building such buildings will take time. Even if they are in progress, there's no way (in my mind) that they can be completed before next summer, because if they were close to completion I think news about this would have leaked back. Buildings are difficult to hide. Once the buildings are complete, the current proposal would be to merge branches into ward-sized branches under one district and have a "test stake", that is, the district would function like a stake but would remain under the direction of a mission president. So I don't see the formation of the stake likely for at least 18 months.

So assuming that the temple won't begin construction before the creation of a stake (which I would assign a 80% probability to), I don't see a completed temple for at least two and a half years.

I don't think the Church is in a hurry. The Freiberg Temple (to which Kiev is assigned) is currently being remodeled and expanded. One interpretation of this is that the Church has no plans to build a temple anytime soon.

Now for a rumor or two. First, I was in a large meeting in Kiev where the area president (Elder Hancock) gave a talk. This was last spring. He suggested (although didn't firmly say this) that there is land for the temple in Kiev. This is one of the times I asked around the office about this, and the specific answer to this question was that "Elder Hancock must know something that we don't."

I think this basically means that this was a slip of something that shouldn't have been said. Even then, the existence of land does not imply that construction will begin soon.

Second, we had some Americans in the Chernigov branch go home to Tri-Cities, Washington (site of the new Columbia River Temple). They came back with a rumor which they promptly spread around the branch that the temple would be under construction in the "near future" and claimed that the contractor would be the same one who was building the Columbia River Temple. This was last summer. Their suggestion was that construction was to begin after the dedication of the Columbia River Temple, and (hopefully) before snowfall.

Seeing no announcement (and I'm not surprised that there hasn't been one) I think this rumor can be discarded.
Michael Joner Send Email
 
A reply to "Kiev Information Request" 23 Oct 2001
Sister Smiley (and others interested) -

I just got back from Kiev about two months ago, so you'll want to remember that this information is that old.

Until this past summer, there were at least two American families in the city of Kyiv (both working for the Embassy as I recall). There are others in the country. You'll find that Kyiv differs from many European countries in that a lesser percentage of the people speak English -- but many (especially among the youth) speak it well.

Church meetings are great. If you are living in Kyiv, you will probably get translation by the missionaries. Actually, Primary in one of the Kyiv branches was entirely in English until the two aforementioned families moved out (that says something for the amount of Primary-aged children who are members). You will find that the members are very polite and anxious to meet Americans, and you'll also find that they will look to you for an example. Many members in Ukraine justify their actions and expectations based off of what they see American members do.

Medical care is fairly good. There is a facility called the American Medical Center in Kyiv. It is not far from the Embassy. The standards are very close to or equivalent to those in standard American facilities. (Most missionaries in the Kyiv Mission were sent there for medical problems until the recent assignment of a mission doctor to the mission.) I do not know if or how they handle insurance (the Church has a different arrangement with Missionary Medical for international missionaries).

You'll find public transportation in Kyiv to be generally reliable, although based on what I know of the two families, I expect that the U.S. government will provide you with a car. (You'll need to learn that their driving habits do differ from ours.) You'll probably also get an apartment (large and luxurious by Ukrainian standards but probably significantly smaller than what you're living in now if you're like the average American). Cost of living is somewhat lower, but that does depend on who you're buying from; I'm convinced that I paid higher prices in Kyiv sometimes because of my accent when buying from individuals.

Ukrainians like to complain about their crime rates and political/economic situation. My opinion (let me stress this as my opinion) is that the total number of crimes in Kyiv (a city of 2-3 million people) is probably less than they are in my hometown of Provo (at 1/15 the population), the political situation doesn't differ much from our own (pre Sept. 11), and the economic situation is worse than ours.

I'm not sure what else to tell you. This is an opportunity that I would probably jump at (remember that I already know a lot of these people and their culture, so I can say that) but I don't know you or your situation, so I am not going to recommend you one way or the other.
Michael Joner Send Email
 

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